Curse

Kijik Oni Hanryuu · Jun 29, 2006, 05:25 AM // 05:25

Vinc what build do you use for the 12 oni kill (PM it to me if you would so as not to take this thing completely off topic)? (ungues farm I suspect?) I would love to use that build once I get my rit leveled.

Gwmaster · Jun 29, 2006, 06:39 AM // 06:39

Ritualist dont suck..i did Vizunah square with my lvl 16 rit and a team of henches on each side. and for farming they are awesome with the awesome skill : Vengegul was khanhei, actualy ritualist is a very good class wen you know how to play it

Kijik Oni Hanryuu · Jun 29, 2006, 07:12 AM // 07:12

Ritualist ownz joo, but my sin ownz you ritualist ;\

yes i sounded like a noobie idiot on purpose

WNxArchmage · Jun 29, 2006, 07:27 AM // 07:27

quanzong... have u ever played pvp?

if not... try it...

if so... hoh has seen some great rit builds... and ive seen some guilds use some pretty sick ganking assassins as well... so idk where ur coming from... but those chars definatly have use...

as far as pve... its just inexperience with assassins... people try to play them like warriors... they die alot... ppl are unhappy... thats y ppl wont trust assassins...

Matsumi · Jun 29, 2006, 09:22 AM // 09:22

I think most of the hate just comes from word of mouth pretty much, "somebody hates it, so must I". Sure, there are going to be some people that don't understand the profession yet, but give'em a break already, lol. I'm sure none of you were total geniuses at playing character classes new to... oh wait, nevermind, I guess everyone looks up builds all the time. Since there aren't any builds for assassins to look up (or not that many), must not be a good character class huh? Dies a lot, doesn't play well, takes too much damage, can't heal like I can with the warrior. Boo hoo, lol.

And with the monks? Really, if you can't adapt to a new profession as far as healing and protecting goes, maybe it's time to realize that you don't know everything yet. I mean, the low armor, whoa, what a big deal... seriously, rangers have just about the same don't they? And what about the tanking eles, didn't find it hard to adapt to them really, or did you? I don't find it hard to try to adapt to other professions, if I know what they generally do. Pulling off a lot of attack combos? How about something that heals on attack/spell/skill? How about something that reduces damage, or prevents so much of it from being caused, or negating it? Take a look at your skills again, might help somewhat for every party member, but one in particular may be esspecially useful to the assassin to keep him going.

And how about those Ritualists? You mean that all those weapon skills, and things like union, shelter, recuperation, don't work pretty well with an assassin if not everyone? I'd beg to differ really. I think it's because most of these players are so used to their old builds, that they don't want to spend the time thinking up anything new that can be beneficial to the entire group, along with assassins. Just plain laziness if you ask me. I started a Ritualist about a week ago, and I don't really go for the healer role. I use spirits that benefit everyone along with myself, and damage dealing. I already have a monk, so I don't think I should have to be a second class one with this character. I do pretty well at it so far I think too. Henched almost every mission without problems, and ones I didn't, no problems there either.

I went into a pretty hard to beat mission (at least for masters) with 2 assassins, an elementalist, and henches, when I brought my monk over to cantha. I didn't have a problem healing the sins at all, and I don't even play one yet. I just thought of what they would be doing, and changed a few skills around. Granted I have to pay attention to what they're doing somewhat to be effective, but it's not that hard. See damage being taken or skills going off, throw on 5 energy skill, more damage, throw on another skill, then they're happy, so they can whip out some combos or whatever.

I think all in all, it's just the same lamers who deemed the mesmer a useless profession in PvE. So buck up little campers (lol, just kidding), if I'm monking, I'll be glad to play with you in groups. Besides, I need more exprience with how the profession works until I start up one. So far I've been watching random pug assassins and pikatchu [henchmen] or whatever his name is.

Silent Kitty · Jun 29, 2006, 10:29 AM // 10:29

I was in Zen Daijun forming a well balanced party of 12+ players for the mission. When I invited a lvl 20 assassin, 3 of my party didn't want him. I still accepted the assassin since he met my requirements. Even at lvl 20 the sin managed to die twice. I didn't mind, since he wasn't spamming to be resurrected. We still got master reward because at least I bothered to get some better levels for the mission.
To be short; Yes, the sin is not the strongest character in the game and dies allot, but who cares? Everybody can play what and how he wants. Don't discriminate each other for the character we like to play. This is not the "real" world. We actually can be nice to each other, no matter what race, nationality or gender.
Feel free to discriminate master Panaku, because he is completely worthless anyway, but please be nice to each other.

wilebill · Jun 29, 2006, 11:57 AM // 11:57

Well, I have an Assassin, a Mesmer, a Ranger, a Warrior, a Monk, and an Ele/mo. I like them all, yet I think that ANet still needs to tweak the Assassin a bit. Sinican wrote:

'another major flaw i see in the class is that after level 20 when the mobs keep increasing in lvl 20+ assassins much needed critical strikes that manage there small energy pool become less and less with no way to keep ciriticals at any type of stable level this include skills the specifically work off of criticals'

Very true. For assassins, criticals should not dwindle as level increases above 20. This would not affect PvP, and would help a lot in PvE.

Vincaro · Jun 29, 2006, 02:14 PM // 14:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kijik Oni Hanryuu

Vinc what build do you use for the 12 oni kill (PM it to me if you would so as not to take this thing completely off topic)? (ungues farm I suspect?) I would love to use that build once I get my rit leveled.

Look in the farming section. It's already been listed there by someone else. As well as in the Merged New Items forum, but that's rather long...

nohooiam · Jun 29, 2006, 02:51 PM // 14:51

a good assassin requires some common sense from the player. its impossible to expect that from a pve pug. thus, assassins in general will suck.

Blackest Rose · Jun 29, 2006, 06:56 PM // 18:56

My poor assassin - went to level 20 on the training island.... did some quests with henchies and no one wants them in any quest/mission now.

Poor girl had to take her to Tyria where she's having a blast and is appreciated.

Vecte · Jun 29, 2006, 07:04 PM // 19:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by quanzong

Assassins do really suck, they just a mimic of the Warrior, but worse. Warriors are not really welcomed to groups, but assassins, they arent welcomed at all to groups. Assassin heal self sucks, 4 seconds you get +9 hp regen, and 67 health after it sucks, I would rather get straight to the point with +127 health. There armor sucks. They look horrible and wimpy, looks like necromancer could own em. Also there dmg sucks! 2 hands for 7 - 17 dmg? LOL. HAMMER 19 (more than assassin max dmg) - 35 (X2 than assassin max dmg). And for speed? It sucks! Warriors sword is ABOUT the same, and deals 15 - 22 dmg, which is WAY better than assassin dmg. And there shadow walks? Who would spawn in front of enemy monk, then the enemy warriors OWN YOU, before your healer can get to you in time for a heal. Assassins, really suck.4 seconds for 50% running that costs 5 mana is a joke.

Ritualist is a joke too, but not even close to assassin. They just like necromancer but worse. Spirts are like wells, and minions, except can be casted anywhere. And there attack spells are WAY worse than necromancer. They have a spirt where you can be a 55 ritualist, but nobody is going to do it because there spirts suck!

can we please meet in a pvp area? ingame name = sektor xiang, pls whisper me.

Genraka · Jun 29, 2006, 08:32 PM // 20:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zethron Ahriman

Ok, so why is it that noone likes assassins apart from them dying abit too quickly, I mean, for new players to the game who wish to try an assassin, and carry them through the game, I feel this will kill their fun in the game and will lose trust in the GW community... I know many people who have deleted assassins due to being groupless, kicked, etc. GIVE THEM A CHANCE! I know you would feel bummed too if you were new and found noone accepted you in groups and called you a noob. Anyway this is my opinion, I allow assassins in my group, and have encountered many good assassins, anyway, that's my opinion, what's yours ?

~Zeth

Im one of thouse people. My assassin has a ton of greens, 15k Luxon, alot of elites including AoD (which i used alot). I ended up deleting him for the above reasons. It got so bad that i had to BRIBE people to let me in their groups, I was giving 1k per party member and an extra 500g to the monks every time i died, i also sometimes gave away farmable greens to the party leaders.

I deleted him not just because of the hate towards the class, I realized that behind that cool,fun class there is nothing usefull. They dont tank (most assassins think otherwise...), they dont nuke, they dont have any special usefull builds, All they do is spike and they are very bad at it.

The only good assassin that is almost acceptable is the A/R Critical Barrager.All i know is that i wont accept any invites from assassins, I have not played with a good assassin yet so i doubt they are out there.

sinican · Jun 29, 2006, 09:54 PM // 21:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by nohooiam

a good assassin requires some common sense from the player. its impossible to expect that from a pve pug. thus, assassins in general will suck.

thats rather narrowminded isnt it... and that same thing goes for ANY class... not just assassins... a good player can still have a sucky assassin... you all always want to blame the player though...

its just plain ignorance, I'm sorry but it is... Its not to say that there are players that do suck but pretty much labeling all assassins as having sucky players playing them is bull...

and really to other people in regards to how assassins think they are tanks... do you have a degree in phsycology??? or is that again ignorance speeking... believe me over 90% of the assassins out there KNOW THEY AREN'T TANKS but its nifty how the assassin is the ONLY other MELEE CLASS thus they actually have to be in melee range... hrmm makes them look like tanks doesn't it makes them play like tanks doesn't it...

do you people know what a tank is??? a Tank is a Stance Defensive Warrior... maybe all of you are thinking that all assassin act like they are a wammo... well they actually are aren't they now... they have to run in do dmg and get out... what do you call that??? or havent you smarties figure out what label to give an assassin ...granted there is a smart and stupid way to play an assassin but the line between them is a very thin one at best... all assassins have to be in agro to do dmg just some have a harder time getting out of the agro before its too late... and really it doesn't matter to much if the mobs agroed on someone else because they change their agro real quick to that little assassin trying to get his/her share of dmg in and at lvl 20+ mobs their 60AL doesn't cut it specially since their armor doesnt have those nifty conditional modifiers that the OTHER MELEE class has to dampen the blows nor the absorption runes nor the shield nor the stances

sorry for the anger but seriousely how many times must i reply to people that THINK THEY KNOW FOR A FACT SOMETHING THAT IS STRICTLY A MATTER OF OPINION WITH NO SUPPORTING EVIDENCE OF FACTUALITY.

FACT... assassins are melee characters
FACT... assassins have 70AL
FACT... Warriors are melee
FACT... Warriors have 80AL

is it really hard to understand whats going on here people... i guess its just easier to blame players than deduct LOGICAL CONCLUSIONS

Lilanthe · Jun 29, 2006, 10:38 PM // 22:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by sinican

...FACT... assassins have 60AL...

Assassins have 70AL

sinican · Jun 29, 2006, 11:24 PM // 23:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lilanthe

Assassins have 70AL

LOL... HAH... thats great... irony at its best...

thanks for the correction on my oversight.. been playing my rit too much...

Kijik Oni Hanryuu · Jun 30, 2006, 03:39 AM // 03:39

Vecte save a piece of quanzong for me please, Genraka I would love to either fight with you or against you, just to prove you wrong, Sins don't suck at spiking, they actually rock out on it better than eles, Sin= one man spike team Air ele= needs three or four for effective spike, sinican beyond the warrior comparison stuff can you find anything else TRUELY wrong about the sin? I would love to see it, BTW mods please close this thread it is going nowhere, it's just a bunch of people saying sins suck cuz they can't play em and me and a few others having to constantly defend what is a great class.

Only thing I think needs to be tweaked is crit hit ratio.

Kijik Oni Hanryuu · Jun 30, 2006, 03:44 AM // 03:44

oh and uh
Fact..Sins can spike without a previous warm-up
Fact..Warriors can't spike without adrenaline build
Accepted..Sins are made for caster killing, if they tele to the back lines and drop their target fast enough they should be fine
Accepted..Tanks are MEANT for taking damage and fighting other tanks

corrected my "facts" after reading big tru's statement

and no if the sins sucks it doesn't mean the player "sucks" he is merely inexperienced and doesn't know how to play a NEW class. Only reason rits are getting love is because they ummm heal. Monks never got hate because even a retard can hit a button and heal someone, rit= pseudo monk thus rits dun get hate, I have a damn good feeling that my Ritual Lord spirit warder rit will likely get a little hate and I will suck with him at first but Ileanr to live with it.

jaibas17 · Jun 30, 2006, 05:43 AM // 05:43

well, i think that if assasins lernt to fall back to caster lines with their skills, they would at least evade death, am I right?

BigTru · Jun 30, 2006, 06:11 AM // 06:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kijik Oni Hanryuu

Fact..Sins can spike without a previous warm-up

And have a recharge afterwards

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kijik Oni Hanryuu

Fact..Warriors can't spike without adrenaline build and even then it is hard

How is it hard for a warrior to spike?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kijik Oni Hanryuu

Fact..Sins are made for caster killing, if they tele to the back lines and drop their target fast enough they should be fine

That's not a fact. That's an interpetation of their "purpose" (Not that A.Net's idea of a proffesion's purpose means anything... Elementalists... need I say more?). What is stopping me from putting a teleportation skill on my warrior or simply sprinting to the backline? (assuming you're talking about PvE)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kijik Oni Hanryuu

Fact..Tanks are MEANT for taking damage and fighting other tanks

Again, opinion. Can you tell me exactly why I cannot use a normal warrior build (the damage dealing, 16 weapon attribute, 9-11 stregnth, 3-5 attack skills) in PvE? What is preventing me from NOT bringing Tactics skills for tanking purposes?

Kijik Oni Hanryuu · Jun 30, 2006, 06:36 AM // 06:36

what is preventing people from getting it into their thick skulls that sins can be played right and that they aren't tanks? Also I know that the tank thing is "opinion" but what I am saying is they are the only class fit for it IMO and in the opinions of many others. I also know that the caster killing thing is an interpretation of purpose, it is a theory, like say the big bang theory, it can NOT be exstensively proved but it is accepted as truth.
I know that warriors can spike too, but not with the ability we sins can from what I have seen.
Don't warriors have a recharge after hitting spike? They have to regain adrenaline, especially if they use a finisher skill like Final Thrust.
The caster killing is also a well known accepted theory.

I want to thank both sinican and bigtru for being able to partcipate in a healthy debate with me without the need for flames or anger.

jaibas you are very right, the only minute problem with that is the matter of the sin holding the aggro of any mosters he was near when he teleported back to caster lines, this is one of the FEW situations where a sin should tank, and only a few monsters could be drawn into caster lines, at the most, and the sin can handle another monster or two, even after firing off a massive combo.